Matthias Bühler and Ulrich Gehmann gave an interview on Ideal Spaces and the city at the Shaping the City conference in Venice, October 2018. It was recorded in-situ, which explains the background noise in this recording. The topics discussed are of prime interest, particularly today, as cities begin to move away from their traditional status as city and instead become amorphous, ever-growing urban agglomerations. To keep the city a ‘human’ place, we need new ideals for new spaces – ideals that abandon the old functionalist paradigms of city planning and counteract the ceaseless urban sprawl.